“Yes, I am an incubator”: an interview with a surrogate mother Victoria Kochetova

Victoria Kochetova was in the hospital three times, but she has only one daughter. Two other children are being raised by people who are completely strangers to her: one family from St. Petersburg, the second from China (this was even before Russia introduced ban for surrogacy for foreign biological parents).

The other day, Vika told Lifehacker whether the maternal instinct turns on in a surrogate mother, who she considers herself in relation to such children, and whether she celebrates their birthdays.

About motherhood

— What is surrogacy for you?

“For me, this is both a way to earn money, a profession and an opportunity to help a childless couple. I give birth to another family. This is not my child. I am being implanted with an embryo. Egg from another woman, a spermatozoon from a man who is nobody to me - neither a boyfriend nor a husband. That is, there is no relationship between me and this child from a biological point of view.

I'm going through a full examination. If I am approved and the embryo is transferred to me, I carry it and give birth.

I understand from the very beginning that this is someone else's child, which I will give away after the birth and will never see again.

For carrying and giving birth, I receive a reward, so, of course, this is work.

But the work is special. Because in surrogate motherhood I see an opportunity to express myself, to give meaning to my life.

Is it easier to be a surrogate mother than just a mother?

— Yes, responsibility is 10 times less. Because I'm not the one making the baby. I'm just helping. In surrogacy, I just love the state of pregnancy. And they pay well for it.

We all follow the path of least resistance. I don't need big money. For me, a million is a good reward.

There are few places where you can earn so much in a year in Taganrog. Why put in extra effort when you can make money like that?

- If it's not a secret, how did you spend the money received for the birth of children?

- When I went to the first program, I already had a blog. First fee spent on the development of his channel in social networks. On the second I bought an apartment.

— What was the most difficult?

- The most difficult thing is toxicosis. If it were not for him, I would still be looking for the program. Toxicosis was up to the 16th week of all three pregnancies.

Didn't want to keep the kids?

- No. I already have a daughter Sonya, she is 6 years old. I gave birth to her at the age of 23 and immediately realized that I would not have any more children. I don't want that kind of "happiness" anymore.

I enjoyed being pregnant, and the delivery was medically easy: I was in labor for 20 hours, but for the first time, this is normal. It became difficult later, when I had already returned home from the hospital. I did not experience any joy of motherhood. It got to the point that I, leaving for groceries, then sat in the car for a long time, just not to return home.

For the first three years, I regretted that I had decided to give birth, I considered it a mistake. Now I don't think so. Everything worked out as it should have.

I love Sonya. But her ex-husband is raising her: after our divorce, her daughter lives with him - this was a mutual decision. We meet with Sonya on weekends, have a great time.

Why do you think you never experienced the joy of motherhood?

“I take parenthood too seriously. Motherhood is a huge responsibility, not only until the age of 18. She is for life. This is a limitation for me. I have to educate my daughter, bring her to a place where she can provide for herself.

I bought an apartment and will give it to my daughter when she turns 18. But I still remember - that's not all. And so it will be all my life, to the end. The freedom that was before will never be. I will always know that there is at least one person I owe.

We do not ask our children if they would like to live in this particular time, in this family. All responsibility, it turns out, lies with the parents. I made a man, I brought him into this world, at this particular time.

It always seems to me that my daughter will ask me: “Did you even see what was happening? Why did you decide to have a baby?

Have you asked your mother this question?

- Yes. I never understood where her eyes were, what motivated her when she decided to have a baby in 1994. She admitted that the times were difficult, many were starving, but there was no choice: after 40 years, she would no longer give birth. I was my mother's last chance.

What I will answer my daughter, I do not know. Probably she was stupid.

About how it all began

How did you get the idea to become a surrogate mother?

- On VKontakte, I was in the Martyata group for women who were due to give birth in March. Then I waited for Sonya.

As a form of entertainment, this group offered different topics for discussion. One of the questions was: “Could you become a surrogate mother?” I wrote that I could. I wrote it just like that, and then I began to think seriously about this topic. I went to google what it is, is it possible to become a surrogate mother in Taganrog or is it necessary to live in Moscow.

When I realized that everything is possible and accessible, I told my husband. He, of course, was against it. It suited him that we had a family, that I was at home. Yes, and he was sitting at home, it was impossible to tear him off the sofa.

He earned a lot in those days, we had enough for everything. There was no such thing that we saved up for anything. They could wake up in the morning and think: “We want a big TV with a curved screen” - and go and buy it the same day. He gave me as much money as I needed.

But when we divorced him, I was able to resolve the issue of surrogacy myself. I posted an ad and started looking for an agency.

I didn't go into the first program for the money. And not even out of nobility, to help a childless couple - this was one of the motives, but not the main one.

I wanted something meaningful in life, something big. Understand correctly: I am after the decree, my daughter is three years old, I needed something large-scale so that life would make sense. And what could be bigger and easier than surrogate motherhood?

How did your family react to your decision?

- The most inadequate reaction was issued by the former mother-in-law. She came to my mother, demanded that I be banned from the program, started a fight. She leaned out the window and shouted: "The whore's mother lives here."

The mother-in-law even went on a talk show with this topic, she was lured, promising to solve all her problems. In the television studio, she said that I would sell all my health, and when Sonya grows up, I will file for alimony, apply for disability and live at the expense of my daughter. She is very afraid of this, although I help the child.

I even already wrote a receipt that I refuse alimony from my daughter. But this did not add peace to the mother-in-law. Believes that I will demand something through guilt. Perhaps she thinks so, because she herself constantly repeats that her son owes her.

Friends were kind. It's a profession, that's all.

- Does the daughter know that the mother gave birth to children to strangers?

- I explained to her that there are people who do not have children, and I help them become parents. So it comes naturally to her. She sometimes tells in the kindergarten that her mother gave birth to a child to another aunt. They don't believe her. I somehow came to the kindergarten, and Sonya said to another child from the group: “Here is my mother, they asked her.” He asks - I confirm.

About biological parents

What relationship did you have with your biological mothers? Did you feel jealousy, was there an obsessive monitoring of what you eat, how you live, how much you walk?

- For the first time, I didn’t communicate with my biological parents at all, because they are from China. The barrier was not only a language barrier: I got into the program in 2020, it was difficult for them to come to Russia due to covid restrictions. Only representatives of the agency through which they signed the contract got in touch with me.

I spent my entire pregnancy in Taganrog, then I came to give birth in Moscow. I saw my biological mother once, already in the hospital. The conversation was short.

After the hospital, we went to do a DNA test. When they brought the results, they gave me money in a bundle in the same car. Parents with the child went home, I went to a rented apartment to prepare for my return to Taganrog.

- The second biological mother also turned out to be undemanding?

- I was lucky with my biological parents for the second time. The family lives in St. Petersburg, so I spent most of my pregnancy at home, just before childbirth went to Peter.

We contacted my mother by phone mainly after my trips to the doctor or after taking tests. She didn't have any requirements. On the contrary, she sometimes seemed too calm and aloof. I began to worry if I had changed my mind about becoming a mother. It turned out that he was just such a person.

She said that she didn’t read my blog because she didn’t like to worry, she was more comfortable protecting herself from everything that could disturb peace.

Sometimes I even had to force it to start acting. For example, I was very worried that after my arrival in St. Petersburg I had not been to the doctor for a whole week. This is after the road, the flight. Well, it was time to do an ultrasound, doppler. I had to "peck" her brain to get an appointment. After all, I can’t just take it and go where I want, get registered. Mom decides everything, she chooses a clinic, a doctor.

Is this behavior the standard or rather the exception?

- Usually biological parents are more demanding. Any surrogate mother should be ready to take tests to confirm that she does not drink alcohol, drugs and does not smoke. During my first pregnancy, I was checked twice through an agency.

It happens that video cameras are installed at the surrogate mother’s house, and a person is assigned to her during a walk to keep an eye on her.

Even in the toilet and shower, cameras are hung so that the woman does not masturbate there.

I consider such total control paranoia. If you don't have any space for privacy at all, it's a prison.

— Is it true that clients are looking for strange ways to get a baby as soon as possible if the due date has come up, but the surrogate mother does not give birth in any way?

- In the second program, we tried some ways, but not so much because the biological mother wanted to get a child as soon as possible. It was important for her that her daughter was born on some day. At first, she did not want a certain zodiac sign. Then I didn't want certain numbers. Most of all, she was afraid that her daughter would be born on December 9th. In her opinion, this is the most terrible date according to some horoscope or astrological calculation. The irony of fate is that on the 9th I gave birth.

But at the initiative of the biomom, we tried different ways to make the birth happen before the unpleasant date. For example, at the 40th week of pregnancy, I went to the bath with her - I do not advise anyone to do this.

The first time there was no dousing with cold water. Then with pouring. I also tried to dive into the hole.

A video where a pregnant woman is poured with water and steam pours from the body caused a storm in my blog.

I myself am a southerner, accustomed to the heat. In Taganrog, it's normal to drive a car without air conditioning at 45 degrees. Therefore, the bath was well tolerated. But the method is controversial and did not help to give birth faster.

- What was the most memorable moment?

- At the 10th week, the result of the analysis for the sex of the child came. I receive all medical documents, because formally the child is mine. It's like a normal pregnancy, but with a nuance - there is an egg donor.

But I consider it unethical when some leftist person is the first to know the gender of the child. Therefore, without opening the letter, I forward it to my mother. She should be the first to know. It was a very memorable moment for both of us. After a couple of seconds, she writes back: girl.

About childbirth and children

— How does the birth of a surrogate mother end? Are they taking the child away from her?

- The first time I gave birth in Moscow. The child was taken away almost immediately. I only had time to look at his face for a couple of minutes - and that's it.

The second time, things didn't go according to plan. We agreed with the clinic. The biological parents ordered two chambers: one for themselves, the second for me. Surrogate mothers often give birth in this clinic, so there is a fee for one, where there are no facilities for children.

But on the evening of December 9, I had a slight fever, and intestinal upset began. I was escorted out of the clinic and taken to Botkin. Biomama and her husband wrote me messages to the last, scolded the medical staff, promised to sort it out, to punish the guilty. They said: “We will decide everything now, you will not be taken anywhere. Cling your teeth to the bed, you're not going anywhere."

As a result, I was transferred to Botkin anyway, where I was on the rights of an ordinary woman in labor. They were very surprised at my appearance, because half of the women in labor have such a reaction as I have - the body is preparing for childbirth. But, probably, there were still some reasons for the transfer.

Naturally, biological parents were not allowed into Botkin. I gave birth on December 9th. The child was brought to me on the third day, when tests came that I had no infection. I spent the day with the girl.

Since I was not ready for this, I went around her from all sides, I was very afraid to take her in my arms. She was even nervous that she was groaning.

I tried to tell her about her mother and father, that they were waiting for her. But no maternal instinct has awakened. I clearly understood - this child is not mine.

- When the child was taken away, how did you feel?

- When I was driving home after giving birth, I even wrote on my blog that I experienced incredible emotions that I had never experienced in my entire life. This is delight, and joy, and emptiness. There was a sense of transition. As if this is not the road from the hospital, but the path from a past life to a new one. But that feeling soon passed.

I think that the feeling of emptiness after childbirth appeared not because of events, but because of hormones.

Why is surrogacy not easy money?

- Why? For some, this is just easy money. Give birth to not scary. I repeatedly broke my arms and legs when I played sports, I had migraines. I would not say that childbirth is much worse than this. The second labor was normal, it only hurt for the last 10-15 minutes. And the third time, until the last, I did not believe that this was childbirth. Because they were painless.

It is easier to give birth than to bear. If it was possible to give birth for others without 9 months of pregnancy, I would agree to 20 thousand.

- Who are you for children born in the program? Can this relationship be compared to anything? After all, this is not a native child, but you can’t call him a complete stranger either.

- I feel like a babysitter. I was with the child for money, then the need for my services disappeared, and we parted.

My own daughter also had a nanny. When my husband and I divorced, the child moved to another area, and the nanny was no longer suitable for us. After a while, she called and asked to bring Sonya, because she missed her very much.

But my situation is different.

I am a nanny who was just pregnant, did not communicate with these children, did not play with them, did not speak.

Even if I wanted to, I could not find something for which I would become attached to them.

Do you celebrate children's birthdays?

I don't always remember those dates. Last time, only at the end of the day, a friend thought - December 21, something familiar. Yes, I gave birth on December 21! I have my own life. These are not my children.

How the process works

How do women become surrogate mothers?

- Just publish or search for ads on the site "Mom‑Search"or through thematic groups" VKontakte.

Now the situation has changed, because many have left and are looking for families for the program in other countries. Girls write, ask me for lawyers to sort out foreign contracts. But I can not advise anything, because this is a new topic, unfamiliar even to experienced surrogate mothers.

Is the contract so difficult to draw up?

- The contract is most often drawn up by lawyers who are hired by biological parents. You can buy a ready-made contract in any agency. It costs from 15 to 200 thousand rubles. It is expensive. Therefore, contracts are resold by those who have them.

I was repeatedly asked to sell the contract. But I think this is wrong, dishonest in relation to the agency that hired lawyers. Well, the contract should reflect the interests of both parties, so it is better to draw up and adjust it for yourself, be sure to consult with a lawyer. It is better to pay and be more confident in the outcome of the program.

I checked my contract and remade it for myself so that my rights were very clearly stated in it. I know that surrogate mothers sometimes draw up a contract in their own words, and then they find out that such a document has no legal force. There are those who do not care about everything, they do not check anything anywhere, but this is rather an exception.

— Who is more at risk: biological parents or surrogate mother?

- Parents are not protected by anything, because a surrogate mother can safely leave the maternity hospital and register the child for herself. Surrogate mothers are not protected in any way from non-payment of money. Even if you give birth through an agency, even if you have a contract.

Everything can be written in the documents, but if one of the parties deceived, then you will have to defend your rights through the court. Courts require knowledge and money. Most surrogate mothers do not have this. Therefore, they sit, wait and pray that in the end they still pay.

There are few good agencies, they take money for themselves before the transfer and keep it in the account.

I think we need control in this area. In fact, now the documents are signed by a notary, but he only confirms that everyone was of sound mind and the signatures are genuine. Nothing else. Even when we buy an apartment, we have an entry in the USRN. A child is not an apartment, it is much more difficult.

It seems to me that it is necessary to create an agency that will ensure that the surrogate mother does not have the opportunity to register the child for herself, and the parents do not have the opportunity not to pay.

— Did you have to refuse candidates and why?

“I turned down same-sex couples. Once she refused a couple for whom it was the last chance. The biomama has only one egg. It was impossible to stimulate more because of illness. Either the embryo will take root, or this woman will not have children at all. I didn't take the risk.

There were candidates with HIV and the risk of becoming infected at birth was 2–3%. Refused.

She also said no when she found out that the family was taking out a loan for my services.

It triggers and infuriates everyone, but I think: if you want a child, make money first. If there is no money, then children are not for you.

You can hate me endlessly, but you need to be a resource on all fronts - morally and financially. What loan? The child will be born, so much money will be needed there, and you will repay the loan.

About blogging

How did the blog come about?

- At first I just had an Instagram page *. When I became pregnant with a surrogate child, I began to publish news about my pregnancy there. More for myself, because I like to share what I live.

Initially, my blog was no different from many pregnancy pages. Until recently, I did not tell that I was a surrogate mother. Because I wanted to know how subscribers would react when they found out the truth. And it was incredibly epic.

After I gave birth in Moscow, I record a video on the plane to publish it on my blog. I show that I’m flying home alone, and I say: “This is not Dimin (my boyfriend) child and not my child. I'm a surrogate mother."

I post a post. I turn off the phone. The plane is taking off. When we landed, my phone even hung on the number of messages. A thousand new subscriptions, two thousand coverage, despite the fact that before there were 300 people in total. I understand that I have found something. I like hype, you can grow on it. Thanks to the topic, she gained 50 thousand subscribers.

Now the topic of surrogate motherhood is over, and my blog has turned into something that is not yet clear. Because of this, replies began, misunderstanding. It's even worse than a hate. Because hate is still interest.

- Did the blog interfere? How did biomoms and agencies react to the fact that the entire history of pregnancy and relationships with clients becomes public?

– Many agencies do not cooperate with surrogates mom bloggers. I understand them perfectly. Not only those who hide something are against the blog.

Everyone follows the blog. And any phrase I carelessly said can scatter into very high-profile headlines. For example, I came to Moscow to give birth, and they settled me in an apartment where the tap does not work. You can make a scandal out of this: “A surrogate mother arrived in Moscow in her ninth month of pregnancy, where she cannot wash herself.” Making an elephant out of a fly is easy. This is a risk.

Because of the blog, biological parents may not take a surrogate mother into the program, even if she suits them in all other respects. Doctors also have a negative attitude - they do not want publicity.

About haters and feminists

Do you often face criticism?

- The first time, when they just started writing nasty things to me, I was upset.

When they write to you once: “You are an incubator,” you think and feel sad. The second time - you already agree: "Yes, I am an incubator." For the third time, I myself will hype on this.

I found a sign with the inscription "Incubators", took a picture near it and published it on my blog. Here is my answer.

Criticism addressed to me, insults - it's all such a "bayan", they don't write anything new and original, I don't even read it. Such messages are like white noise.

Have you ever gotten into threats?

— Two years ago I was approached by girls who call themselves radical feminists. They accused me of allegedly advertising surrogate motherhood and calling girls into the program. In their opinion, surrogate motherhood should be banned and condemned.

Then there was a very hard hat. My profile in social networks was demolished, I suspect with their participation. They found my address, threatened me, wrote that they knew where I lived. Someone punctured the wheel of my car. Then I hung cameras outside the house.

Do you disagree with the accusations?

- I do not advertise surrogacy, I do not say how great and easy it is. On the contrary, she showed how bad it was, how I left Sonya for a whole month and a half when I left for Moscow and St. Petersburg, how she missed her. I honestly wrote about toxicosis, about all the difficulties, pitfalls.

I don't understand why the questions feminists right to me. Many women go into surrogacy not for the idea - they are pushed by need, for them this is literally the last chance to survive and feed their family.

Why are there no questions about the position of such women? It is much more difficult for a woman with a child to work than for a man. Even remotely, the mother is forced to combine work with raising children, cleaning, cooking, she constantly has to be distracted. Freelancing men don't have that problem. He will close in the room, and just try to go to him. It is forbidden - he is a man, he works.

Kindergarten like should unload a woman. But he closes 50% of professions for me. I want to be a truck driver, go away for five days. But a mother can't do that. For the next 10 years, she will work where the situation allows.

A woman needs support, a man should have exactly the same demand in terms of raising children as a woman. Give women adequate support, then only those who are really interested in surrogacy will go into surrogacy. They will be driven by ideology, not need.

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