“In the Arctic, you realize that nature is on a completely different scale”: an interview with glaciologist Diana Vladimirova

It turns out that to learn more about climate change and take action, you can study the ancient ice. This is done by glaciologists - scientists who go on expeditions, drill glaciers, collect data, and submit it for analysis. All this helps to better understand the power of nature and what is happening to it in our time.

We talked with glaciologist Diana Vladimirova about the profession, scientific discoveries and the harsh life in the Arctic.

About the profession

— Who are glaciologists, what do they do?

Glaciologists are people who study glaciers: how they move, how they melt, what it means for us, how it affects climate change, drinking water supplies, sea levels.

There are many types of glaciologists. There are chemists who study the composition of glaciers. There are those who study snow and those who study avalanches, the nature of their formation and ways to prevent disasters. And there are people like me who use glaciers as a repository of information about the past. We drill into glaciers to get to layers that are thousands of years old, deliver fragments of these layers to the laboratory and study the information that is stored in them. These may be traces of ancient fires,

volcanic eruptions.

I am extracting gas that is trapped in glaciers to find out how things have been with greenhouse gases in the past and what will happen next.

What does this knowledge give us?

- It allows you to understand what will happen to global warming in the near future.

We supply data to people who are engaged in mathematical prediction. Of course, they have their own formulas, but they still lack our data. We measure the shape, depth, layers of the glacier, look at what is under it, and find out how it melted in the past, how it is melting now. Thanks to these data, it is possible to predict by what laws the glacier lives and how soon the sea level will rise from its melting, what will be the consequences of this.

The study of greenhouse gases in a glacier allows you to find out what happened in the global atmosphere, at what rate it changed climate under past warmings, and to calculate forecasts for the future.

Why did you choose this profession?

— I never dreamed of becoming a scientist, it seemed unattainable to me. In high school, I didn't think I was that smart.

I entered the Faculty of Geography of St. Petersburg State University, but it was related to tourism. Appetite came with eating: I met cool teachers, one of them told me that there is such a thing as studying the climate, and even in the past, and even on glaciers. And it all looked like fascinating detectivethat captured me.

I became interested in this and began to use the opportunities of internships and part-time jobs. While I was studying, I went as a laboratory assistant to the Research Institute, where they studied the glaciers of Antarctica. I looked at photographs from expeditions, at the work of scientists, and I was very taken by it. I realized that I have a great research interest and curiosity, which is what a scientist needs.

About the scientific path

— You have a PhD from the University of Copenhagen. Tell us about your scientific path: why did you choose Copenhagen for your degree? How did you get there?

— I was looking for where to go to graduate school after St. Petersburg State University, at the same time I worked at the Research Institute of the Arctic and Antarctic in St. Petersburg and I was sure that I wanted to develop in this area. To write a great paper, you had to find a very strong research institute. And the climate group in Copenhagen was one of the most advanced. They conduct international research, and their main subject of study is Greenland.

It's hard to get to them. But then I was so burned by this idea that I was not at all afraid of possible restrictions, moving, the fact that I was going to enter the Faculty of Physics, having a geographical education. But somehow it worked out. Apparently, the secret is in this lively interest. Plus, you need to ask teachers for advice, train to write applications.

It played into my hands that by the time of admission I already had a good experience in research laboratories, I knew the literature on the topic, I participated in conferences. But I still do not understand how I passed the competition of 62 people for 3 places.

— Why didn't you stay in Denmark after graduate school?

- I lived there for 3.5 years, but I always knew that I would return home. I was very attached to Peter, to the St. Petersburg Research Institute. I wanted to learn and return to pass on this knowledge at home.

Of course, if I had expressed a desire to stay, we would have come up with something, a job would have been found for me. But I returned, continued to work at the Research Institute of the Arctic and Antarctic, and after that I transferred to the Institute of Geography at the Russian Academy of Sciences in Moscow.

— In the last few years you have lived and worked in Cambridge. How did you get there and what did you do there?

“We sometimes get professional mailings, and one of them was an announcement that the British Antarctic Survey is looking for a postdoctoral candidate. They needed a very narrow specialist, but that was exactly what I did in graduate school - I developed a very high resolution method for measuring methane in ice samples. In Cambridge, they needed a person who would reassemble the installation for them and take measurements. I was very supported by my colleagues from the Russian Academy of Sciences in Moscow and encouraged me to apply and go. And I passed.

I moved to England during covid. It was stressful, because we only saw the group on the Web, I went to the laboratory alone, figured out how everything works there. But I quickly joined, it was a very good experience.

My mentor was a woman, the director of the institute is also a woman, and it was great to see how female leadership develops and how women are given the green light in science. And in general, it was great to work there, it was a progressive team and a laboratory.

Where are you working now and what are your plans?

- Now my three-year contract in Cambridge has ended, and for family reasons I have moved to Germany. While I am between projects and I think in which direction I will develop further.

Is there a scientific achievement that you are proud of?

- There are a couple. One is graduate work on measuring methane in a Greenland ice core. This study covered results for the last glacial period, which lasted about 100 thousand years, and there were 25 times global warming and cooling. And in three of these warmings, the temperature changed by the same number of degrees, and for some reason the methane changed differently, although usually the temperature and greenhouse gases are synchronized. In graduate school, I researched why there was such a difference. And it seems that the local source of methane, which was located in the region of Eastern Siberia, was to blame. Then there was a large ice sheet, which during the warming turned into swamps, and they began to produce methane.

And the second achievement is connected with the expedition to Elbrus. This is my first project in which I was fully involved, starting with the application for funding and organizing the trip. I have never been in such high mountains, more than 5000 m, where it is even hard to breathe. But we drilled an excellent quality core there, and then in Britain they became interested in this ice, they wanted to explore it, and we connected Moscow and Cambridge. It turned out that this is one of the oldest ice in Europe. Now, thanks to our discovery, we will be able to reconstruct climate change in Eastern Europe from this ice with very high resolution. The same data is already available for the Alps, which means we will have a complete picture of the European continent from both sides.

And we measured it in Cambridge on an installation that I built and improved with the help of my supervisor.

About expeditions

— You and your research team often go on expeditions, are they all the same?

Expeditions are seasonal work. In the Northern Hemisphere, you can work from early spring to autumn. And if you are going to the Southern Hemisphere, then this is December - February, they have just summer at that time.

Projects for the study of glaciers are also different. With the Moscow scientific group, for example, you can travel every year to the Caucasus and measure how the glacier on Elbrus is melting.

There are one-time projects where we drill shallow ice, and this can be done in one trip. There are projects with very deep drilling in the central part of Greenland or Antarctica. You drill through the entire ice sheet: in Greenland it is 2.5–3 km, in Antarctica it is almost 4 km. This is drilling for several years, it is mothballed for the winter, and in the summer a group comes and continues drilling until they reach the bottom.

- Tell me, where have you been?

My first expedition while still studying at St. Petersburg State University was on Altai from Tuva and from Mongolia. Stunning glaciers, almost unexplored places, wild nature. Everything then was completely new and somehow unbridled. We watched these glaciers move and collected water and ice samples to study. In parallel, I only comprehended expeditionary life.

Also traveled to Russian Arctic — in Teriberka. Before the tourists went there, it was almost wilderness, heavy gray skies, pollution. The atmosphere was rather depressing: there were rickety houses around, dirt and garbage, we cooked our own food on a fire, although we were in a residential village. But, if you look at the horizon, there are almost Scandinavian landscapes around, whales and killer whales emerge against the backdrop of fjords, and incredible beauty. Too bad it gets polluted.

Then I went to Greenland several times for a big drilling project called EastGRIP. I collected samples of surface snow there, studied their properties, watched how greenhouse gases spread. When something happens in the atmosphere, it gets sealed in the snow, and then the snow turns into a glacier. After 1000 years we come, we analyze samples of this glacier in order to find out the climate of the past. And I needed to understand how this signal is formed in real time and whether we correctly interpret the climate of the past. These were very meaningful and cool trips for me, in which I learned a lot.

After that I went to Elbrus. At an altitude of 5600 m, we drilled through the ice to the bottom - 96 m, and we managed to organize an international project with Britain, which I have already mentioned.

— Do you remember your feelings from the first expedition?

- The first expedition was in 2012 to the Altai in the very depths of Tuva, in the steppe, where dry crispy grass is evenly mixed with sheep feces. There are incredible wild landscapes. At some point, the road ends, and you are driving on a narrow gauge railway, and then it also breaks off. When a car can no longer pass, you ride horses or walk several kilometers to the glacier.

The sensations were interesting. Everything did not go according to plan, we had a broken transport, so the road took much longer. Due to the fact that we endlessly stopped by the villages and repaired the car, we managed to communicate with the local population and enjoy the beauty for a longer time. Eating freshly baked bread in the most remote village at the foot of the mountains, when you are already tired and exhausted, is priceless.

Of course, we met Tuvans there. You must always understand that you are a stranger. Shepherds passing by go about their business, and here is your camp. They come into your tent because they perceive it as your home. You need to greet them, be sure to pour tea with sugar. Many of them do not speak Russian, but you still need to sit with them, show your respect.

Before the trip, it seemed to me that the glacier in the photographs looked like some kind of smooth, slippery shaving foam. And I remember the first time I stepped on it. It is not slippery as it might seem - there are a lot of debris on it, it is dotted with dimples, it is loose. It's a feeling from another universe. You do not know how to communicate with the glacier, and you get to know him for the first time. You can feel its breath: during the day a cold wind blows from the glacier, and at night it is warm through the valley.

We slept under the roar of a mountain river and crumbling stones. Natural roar when water washes over huge boulders. We met the sun in the morning, made ourselves a sundial from pebbles. There were also the first experiments of field cooking. I don’t know if I would have dared to go to such conditions now, but then it was amazing.

About preparation for expeditions and life

— How to get into a group of explorers on an expedition?

- To get into a scientific group, you need to be a scientist, student, graduate student, researcher. Sometimes people are recruited from outside the scientific field, they are called field assistant. They help clean up, cook something. This is a good seasonal job. Sometimes such vacancies You can watch if you're interested.

And most importantly, you need to be a good person. Because the personal factor is very important in the group, because situations in the field can be different, and you need to be sure that you can rely on the person next to you. In extreme conditions, the way people express themselves is very aggravated. The camp is a model of society. Everything is in it at the same time. If you have collected leftover food after dinner and locked yourself in your tent, this is bad. If you see garbage or breakage, it is necessary to lift, repair. If everyone walks past, such a camp will not work. These are extreme conditions, where it is very important to support each other and be confident in each other.

How do expeditions usually go?

- To go on an expedition, you first need to understand whether there will be sponsorship, sponsorship applications are written a year in advance. Then, in a couple of months, preparations for the trip begin. You need to collect equipment, gear, buy tickets. This is a very lengthy process that requires attention to detail.

Then you fly to the nearest airport to the area, and from it you get by local transport: by plane, helicopter, cars. For example, in Greenland, we flew from the airport to the camp on a US Air Force plane.

It is imperative to set up a camp on the spot: pitch tents, determine the place for collecting garbage, so that later it can be taken out, find a place for toilet. Then work begins.

A lot of time on the expedition is spent waiting for the right weather. If it is overcast or too windy, you may not be able to do experiments. In the Arctic, you can wait up to two weeks for a helicopter to arrive to take you from the camp to the top of the glacier. Sometimes there is a blizzard, and you lie down and “blizzard” in the energy saving mode, eat nuts and fruits, you can’t leave the tent - you can’t see anything, you will be noticed. Even the toilet should go less often to conserve energy. Sometimes you even need to keep a tent so that it doesn’t blow away.

- What must be taken into account when you go?

- Active preparation begins a couple of months before departure. You need to negotiate with transport on the spot, understand everything from the equipment, whether you need to buy something. Before Elbrus, we trained to put our big stable mountain tents right in the courtyard of the institute. The drilling rig is also checked in advance - suddenly something in it will have to be repaired, then it will be too late.

Plus, you need to collect a sufficient amount of every little thing with you so that you have enough, for example, adhesive tape or screwdrivers. It will be difficult to get all this on the spot, so there are a lot of checks before the expedition. It must be taken into account that we are far from civilization there and there is nothing on the glacier. Therefore, it is better to take more than to forget something.

You need to count and buy food. Food is usually bought in the last settlement before the camp.

And of course, be sure to think about what experiments you will conduct.

But at the same time, you need to understand that no matter how prepared you are, something can still go wrong: you don’t take something from the equipment, or the transport breaks down, or something else. You always have comrades from whom you can ask for help, borrow a jacket, shampoo or a tool.

Plus our return always depends on the weather, we often only buy one way tickets. We know that we will stay there, for example, for about a month, but we do not know exactly how long. Maybe four weeks, maybe five or six.

— How is the life of scientists on the expedition arranged? How does a typical day go?

- I'll tell you how it was, for example, in Greenland. This is a seasonal job for the summer. Everything is preserved for the winter.

At 5-6 in the morning you wake up in your tent. This is not a camping tent, this is a huge canopy of bright color on the street so that it can be seen against the general background. The snow is dazzling so you definitely need goggles.

All life passes in the station building, where you can wash and have breakfast, and work. That's where you're heading. Then, after crunching some muesli, you leave to work regardless of the weather. Maybe it's a nice sunny day, or it can be so cold that your fingers freeze and the wind makes it hard for you to hold your toolbox.

We have lunch time. It is prepared by the chef, it is always something hot. We are going to have dinner all together. In general, the team is very important in the expedition.

Then work continues outside. And those who have no business on the street do computer work or read. There is internet at the station, but usually on such trips everyone tries to do a digital detox and not go to social networks and emails.

Day off we have only on Saturday evening - dinner is obligatory in dresses and ties. Because when you do the same thing every day in the same landscape in work clothes, you can go crazy, and it is important to somehow change the situation. So we change and get ready for dinner. On Saturdays, the chef rests, so we cook ourselves - sometimes a volunteer from the team volunteers to cook something special.

So on Saturdays we measure the days of the week - if Saturday evening has come, then a week has passed. Otherwise, there, in the snow, when there is a polar day around, you can lose track of time. Sometimes in the evenings we play desktops or even watch movies, but very rarely. More often, there is absolutely no strength for this, everyone tries to go to bed early in order to get up early in the morning and start all over again.

The most active can go skiing, some run. For example, I took cross-country skis, it was great to ride them in such an environment. Well, imagine: it’s actually summer in the yard, the sun is shining, and there are endless ice around, a white cover, and you cut through it on skis - where else can you try this? My friend took a kite, we attached it to the sled and also had a lot of fun riding in the wind.

There are showers at the polar stations, and sometimes even a bathhouse, which, however, you don’t go to every day. But if you fly to the top of the glacier by helicopter, there is, of course, nowhere to wash, sometimes you can’t even wipe yourself with wet wipes, because they freeze. True, you don’t get so dirty on the glacier, because there is no city around dust, there is a very clean environment, and there is no need to go to the shower every day. It doesn't bring any inconvenience.

About impressions

— What is the most impressive thing you saw in expeditions?

— In every expedition you see something unusual. For example, when I was in Altai, I saw a camel grazing on a slope in the snow. You wake up in your tent in the outskirts, there is ice all around, and a camel has come from somewhere, digging in the snow and looking for something there.

In Greenland, I was struck by the sheer scale of the glacier. You arrive at the airport, exit it and already see this glacier. I have seen glaciers before, but here the whole mainland is a glacier. You understand how huge it is, you feel its breath - a very cold and dry wind blows on you. You can take a car or even bike and ride along the coast along the edge of this glacier, and it will be of incredible size.

I also saw musk oxen there for the first time - amazing creatures, either a sheep or a bull. They graze there in the ice, and it is completely incomprehensible how they survive there. We met locals, which is also very unusual. On the one hand, these are people like us, they have a connection, a civilization. But at the same time, all sorts of traditions are preserved, they eat whale fat and musk ox meat burgers.

On the eastern peak of Elbrus, a picture stuck in my memory when I saw the shadow of Elbrus - a very even triangle on the clouds. Usually you see a shadow on the ground, but you wake up at the top of more than 5 km, look down, and the clouds are below you. It's hard for you to breathe, because the air is very rarefied, and you see a shadow falling on these clouds. It is such an incredible, some kind of extraterrestrial feeling.

What is the Arctic like?

- Good question. She is different. The Russian Arctic, as I said, looks a little gray and depressing, it is polluted.

There has long been an American military base in the Greenlandic Arctic. Some infrastructure was built there, and then, as the legend goes, they sold it all to the Danes for a dollar and did not clean up after themselves. The Americans also left a lot of pollution, it's very sad.

But in general, in the Arctic, you realize that nature is on a completely different scale. If it is water, then it is a huge icy ocean - only there you will know what really icy water is. If they are rocks, then they are huge rocks towering above you. And in such landscapes, in harsh nature, you understand how disproportionately small you yourself are compared to this greatness.

- How many times have you been there?

- It turns out, three times: once in Russia on the Barents Sea and twice in Greenland.

— Were there any scary or, on the contrary, funny moments?

— After the expeditions, it seems to you that you can do everything: you have a very trained body, because it is physically hard work. And so, thinking I was Superwoman, I went for a walk alone on the rocks in Greenland. There is no one around, it is impossible to shout, and the slopes are very steep, you can easily fall off them. And I got stuck there, hung like a kitten. It was scary, somehow I got out.

It was even creepier when polar bears came to us twice, although our camp is 400 km from the coast. Both times they were young males who had apparently gone astray. WITH bear nothing to do: he walks around the camp, and we sit out in tents.

Some time after the bear left, I had to go to work. And I remember how terrible it was for me to go - suddenly he is still prowling there. Before leaving, I practiced jumping on the snowmobile and running faster. And I thought: how strong is this animal, if, smelling some kind of garbage dump in the heart of Greenland, it traveled hundreds of kilometers to find it!

From funny moments: we had a toilet tent blown off a couple of times. What does our toilet look like? A hole is dug in the ground, a sitting structure made of some kind of plywood and a tent are placed on top. Nearby lies a bright flag - if it is stuck in the ground, it means that it is busy.

Once there was a very strong blizzard, and we all sat at the station and saw how the toilet tent was blown away when our colleague went there. That is, the tent flew away, and he satwithout moving. It did not bother him at all, he was very experienced in such trips, for him it was a moment of unity with nature.

Then I realized that anything could happen on the glacier, and I began to treat everything calmly and philosophically. Well, it happened and happened.

— What is the most difficult part of the expedition, and what is the most remarkable thing?

- The most difficult thing is the constant change of plans and waiting for the helicopter and the right weather. You can’t completely relax, because suddenly you have to urgently run for a flight. But you can’t fly away either, because the weather is bad. This waiting is sometimes exhausting.

Another difficult thing is to synchronize with the team, wait for everyone for lunch, and do everything by myself before the general lunch.

And the most amazing thing is the people. In an expedition, the team is very important, how good relationships are built between you. You are in a unique position and together you overcome difficulties - all that cannot happen in ordinary life. And it's very close. And then these people become your comrades forever.